Answer Compilation - 2008 Trek Madone line

Scott Daubert here - Trek Road Bike Brand Manager. I've been reading the posts in our blog and found common questions that need to be answered. Here's what I have so far:

Color options. It's impossible to please everyone's desire when it comes to colors. I've been passing your comments on to Trek's graphics people so they know where you stand. For the most part the 2008 Madone's colors have been well received but there are some of you with special needs. Keep in mind that our Project One program caters to Trek customers by offering a custom color and graphics palatte.

Project One. 2008 Madones will go be available through Project One on January 1, 2008.

Prices. We will put the 2008 Madone prices on our website soon but we are waiting for some last minute info before doing so. I'm happy to report that although the all-new Madone boasts advanced technology, a full range of fit options and unique upgrades, these bikes won't see a huge price increase.

Fuselage alone. Trek will still offer certain models of the 2008 Madone as a fuselage so you can build the bike the way you want. The models sold as a fuselage are the 6.9 and 6.9 Pro and the 5.2 and 5.2 Pro. We must fill the complete bike orders before we can send out fuselages so sit tight while we get our inventory up to speed. You can buy any 5 or 6 series fuselage through Project One on January 1, 2008.

Fit. We have divided fit from geometry. Think of fit as how you sit on the bike and geometry is how the bike behaves on road. Your fit options are Pro, Performance and WSD. The difference between Pro and Performance fit is the height of your hands - Performance is 30mm taller than the Pro. WSD uses the higher Performance fit hand position.

All of the 2008 Madones have the same proven, stable, predicatable geometry - the same seat and head angles, the same length reach in the toptube and the same length chainstays. The reason you see shorter toptube lengths between the Pro and Performance fit bikes is due to the longer headtubes.

Performance fit equal Pilot. There are differences between the Performance fit bikes and the Pilot bikes. The Pilots have an even higher hand position, more tire clearance and long reach brakes for fender mounting, rack eyelets and slower geometry. The Pilot is fast becoming a commuter and touring favorite.

Chainring options. The Pro fit bikes are spec'd with a standard 53/39 crankset. The Performance and WSD come with either a compact double or a triple crankset.

Seat caps and masts. There are two different seat cap lengths and three different offset options. The standard cap is 120mm x 20mm (length x offset). The offset options are 20mm rearward, 5mm rearward and 10mm forward. The tall cap is 160mm and comes in the same offsets. We are shipping 160mm x 20mm caps this week with the other options available ASAP. So far we are happily impressed with how little the cap scars or scrapes the mast so if you are having to raise and lower your cap to find the right seat height, they seem to be fairly resistant to maring. And there's no cutting so you don't have to worry about making a really big mistake.

6 series availability. We're working on it.

Replaceable derailleur hanger. This has been long lasting war within the walls of Trek but so far the one-piece hanger keeps winning. It's lighter, stiffer, tougher and more accurate than bolt together hangers/dropouts and can be replaced if need be here at Trek HQ.

OCLV is made in the USA. The entire line from the 5.1 to the 6.9 is made in Waterloo, WI, USA.

Rear brake cable routing. About 1000 bikes were built with a rear brake cable that exits the side of the toptube at the seat cluster. The brake works perfectly fine with the side exit. We changed this design after hearing too many complaints about the cable housing hitting rider's legs.  We made a running change so bikes coming off the line today have the brake line exiting the top of the toptube.

Discovery is on the 5.2, not the 6.9. It's true; the team is on the 5.2. The 6.9 fuselages were not ready in time so we painted 5.2 fuselages with 6.9 decals. With team spec (Dura-Ace grouppo, Bonty bars, stem, saddle and RXXXL wheels) bikes weigh 7.0kg (15.4lbs). Not bad for our middle of the range fuselage, eh?

The Madone name. You'd think that with an all new platform there would be an all new name. Trek's Marketing department went round and round with names for a month before sticking with the Madone name. We even put it to a vote and "Madone" came back as the winner. Here's a simple analogy, for those of you that wanted something else: when Ford introduces a new Mustang, they call it the new Mustang because the name has equity; value, identity, a following. We feel that Madone has equity.

The New Madone Ridden to Victory

Today marks the official first win on the all new Trek Madone.  Vladimir Gusev piloted his Team Issue Trek Madone to a stage victory in the Tour of Switzerland earlier today.  I Huge Congratulations to Gusev and to the Team.  I am sure this will be one of many but the first is always the Sweetest!  Less than 2 weeks in the peleton and already the new Madone is making waves. 

One for the road

As I sit here in O'Hare Airport a sense of great accomplishment and relief set in.  The new Madone has been a long time in the making.  This past week at the Dauphine was a true test of the bike and it passed with flying colors.  I hope the rest of the people at Trek that have worked on this project are as proud as I am.  The relief comes because it has been a long day and I am only another hour from home....

The team is right on track to do a great Tour.  All of the riders were looking better toward the end of the week than they were at the beginning.  Over the next couple weeks they will fine tune their fitness and lose the last bit of weight before the grand start in London.  I will be on hand from start to finish so tune back in for some more notes from the road.

Keep on Keepin' on at the Dauphine

The guys are done with their forth day of racing on the new Madone and everything is going fantastic. Yesterday Levi and Contador moved up in the GC after a great showing on Ventoux. We have to remember that these guys are just here to increase their form for the Tour, winning would be great but that is not the focus. That said they are having an amazing race so far. Yesterday was Ventoux. It was my first trip up the behemoth of a mountain. I lived in Colorado all my life and the only climb I can liken it to is Mount Evans. Long and steep and then when it levels out a bit you are above tree line and it is windy and cold, sheer punishment for 20km. The street were lined the whole way with cars and people cheering the riders on as they passed, little consolation for the pain they must have felt.

As you probably well know by now the Team is down one rider in the race. Tom Danielson pulled out on the first long day due to stomach pain caused by sickness. It has also been said that due to this reoccurring sickness he will not be able to race the Tour, sorry Tom. I hope he is recovering and getting ready to have some more fun on his new bike. Wish you the best Tom.

Keen Eyes

Those of you with keen eyes might have noticed that Levi is riding an SRM on his new Madone this week at the Dauphine.  The bottom bracket shell of the new Madone is slightly larger than the cups of a Dura Ace BB; therefor the SRM would not work with the bike.  We worked with SRM to make sure they knew the dimensions of our BB shell and they went to work producing new cranks for the team, the first of which Levi recieved.  The drawings are done and the cranks are being produced, they work like a charm.

The New Madone makes it racing debut!

Today June 11th was the official racing debut of the all-new Trek Madone. It took place in Grenoble France during stage one of the 2007 Dauphine Libere. If you have not been to a major bike race before, the start is a bit anti climactic. The riders usually pile out of the buses and onto their bikes or just kind of mill around a bit and then mosey off onto the start. Today was no different. You can see that George was relaxed as ever just minutes before the start.

For Trek though it was a big day. The all new Trek Madone's racing debut. In it's inaugural day at the races the Madone was put through the paces. 217km with hours of heavy rain mixed in for good measure. When the bike passes the finish line they were not worse for the wear. They performed as expected, not one problem. Every comment we have received from the riders about the new bike has been positive. I look forward to them spending some more time on the bikes so I can share details of their discoveries as they find out how good the bikes really are.

Watch the unveiling of the all-new Madone

As we hoped, the full video of the Madone introduction at the Milwaukee Art Museum is now online.

VeloNews' Lennard Zinn visits Trek

Trek invited several journalists to attend the all-new Madone unveiling, and among them was Lennard Zinn from VeloNews. He took some photos (including molded parts before being bonded into a frame) and wrote up a report on the new Madone. You can read it on VeloNews' web site here.

Hello - From Discovery Team

My name is Ben Coates; I am the Discovery Team Liaison for Trek Bicycles.  Part of my job is communicating the happenings of the Discovery Chanel Pro Cycling Team.  From now on that communication will be found right here on UP The Road; If you would like a brief history of my time with the team starting with the 2007 Tour of California check out this page.

Stay tuned for a little background information on how we delivered the New Madone to the Team.....

Delivering Unmarked Bikes to the Discovery Team

We wanted to have input on the New Madone from The Discovery Channel Pro Cycling Team throughout the development process.  This started with early prototypes being shown to and ridden by team members.  The contact with and detailed information about the new bike was limited for secrecy reasons until March of this year.  When all of the Industrial Design was completed and we were doing ride testing, Trek decided to deliver 5 bikes to the Team for testing.  Testing is a two part system with the Team.  First is having the mechanics look over and do a complete build on the bike.  This helps them see the new technology first hand.  It also helps them to feel comfortable putting one of their riders on the bike.  The second is ride testing performed by the riders. 

In March of this year we took 5 unmarked bikes to the Service Course, basically a warehouse where the Team builds and maintains all the equipment.  Our trip was nearly a disaster when the bike boxes were lost by the airline, you can imagine the stress that caused.  Luckily they found our bikes and delivered them unscathed later the same day.  We spent two days at Service Course talking tech and building up the new bikes.  We then hand delivered a bike to Popovych.  After a brief photo session the bike went for its inaugural ride, which was puctuated by a great review from Popo.  Our trip was a success but it was only the start of integrating the bike into the team......

How tall is too tall?

The new Madone is available for taller riders! Fitting big guys has often been problematic with carbon bikes, which sometimes aren't made in the biggest frame sizes. Not only saddle height and set back matter, but frame stack and reach matter too. There's no rider weight limit on the new Madone. If you're a big guy and want to see if the new Madone will fit you, read on!

Saddle height and set back are the first variables. The new Trek Madone is available in a new larger 64 centimeter frame size. Recently most Trek road bikes have been available only up to 62 cm. The new larger 64 cm Madone permits saddle heights up to about 84 cm with the "standard" seat post cap, and up to about 89 cm with the optional "long" seat post cap (see the table of saddle height ranges). If your seat height is less than 89 cm you can almost certainly adjust it to match on a new Madone. Then slide the saddle back or forward to match your setback. New Madone seat caps will be available with three different set backs to accommodate most riders' positions.

Frame stack and reach are next. Frame stack relates to how much vertical drop you like from the seat to the handlebar, and frame reach makes up the frame's part of the horizontal reach from seat to handlebar. To determine your current bike's frame stack, measure from the ground to the top of the head tube if it has an integrated head set, or to the top of the head set cup if it has an external headset (call this measurement A), then measure from the ground to the center of your bike's bottom bracket (call it measurement B). Subtract the two to get your frame's stack: frame stack = A - B. Now you can compare your current bike's frame stack to that listed in the new Madone's geometry table. To decide which size Madone will permit the handle bar height you like, consider adding or removing spacers under the stem (a maximum of 40 mm of spacers is allowed). Be sure to look at both the classic "Pro Fit" and the 3 cm higher "Performance Fit" to compare frame stack. Click to get a bigger view of the new Madone's geometry table:

Frame reach is next, and helps determine what length stem you'll need. To use the Frame Reach entry in the table, first measure your current bike's frame reach, then compare it to the frame reach in the new Madone geometry table. If it doesn't match within a few millimeters you can often change the stem length to make up any difference. Based on our research, most riders will be right on the money, and many riders will be making a change for the better (away from extreme stem lengths and towards more typical lengths). If that's not the case with your set up, consider whether you're currently in the best riding position or might want to change it a bit.

What size Madone should I get?

With the integrated seat mast, the new Madone may raise some questions about fitting. The new Madone’s seat mast is different from most, because it can’t be cut. Instead, all height adjustment comes from sliding the seat cap up or down on the mast, and by choosing a standard or long seat cap.

Above, the top photo shows a few of the new Madones ridden in the Trek 100 this past weekend. The second one is a close up of the seat installed on the seat cap on the frame. The bottom photo shows the frame’s seat mast with the seat cap removed. You can see the height graduation marks. The top one must be covered by the seat cap; that’s the maximum height. Incidentally, the top of the frame’s seat mast is completely closed. Don’t cut that off; it not only keeps a lot of water out of the frame, it also contributes to the strength of the mast.

On the left is the long seat cap (optional), and on the right is the standard seat cap (included).

With that understanding of the seat mast and seat cap system, here’s a table showing the range of saddle heights you can achieve with the two seat cap lengths. Click on the thumbnail image to get the full size version.

Home Grown Madone

Brad Towne asks: Are the Madones still made in Wisconsin? I liked the fact that Trek kept its top-line bikes manufacturing close to its design team.

Answer: Great question Brad! Yes, all the OCLV Madones (whether OCLV White, OCLV Black or OCLV Red) are still made in Wisconsin, just down the hall from the designers and engineers involved. In fact all manufacturing operations are carried out here: from cutting and kitting the preforms, to hand-molding, to bonding and paint, it's all done at our headquarters in Waterloo. You're right, it *is* nice to be able to keep such a close eye on things.

Lance on the new Madone

Here's a clip of Lance and John Burke talking about the new Madone shot from a digital camera.  We'll have the full presentation (better quality) available soon. 

10 Highlights from the Worldwide Madone Premiere

This just in my email box from an attendee of the all-new Madone unveiling..OK, he didn't provide the links, but I did...

Thanks for having me Scotty.  Great Evening.  Great Bike.  Here's my top 10 from the evening...

1. Enjoying the Calatrava-designed, Milwaukee Art Museum - a fitting venue for a beautiful bike.
2. Seeing the surprise entrance of Lance and his feedback on the all new Madone.
3. Watching dealers and media snap pictures and video like Paparazzi throughout the evening.
4. Enjoying the "talk show" style dialogue between Lance and John Burke.  Move over Letterman.
5. Hearing Madone development and testing stories from John Burke, Tyler Pilger & Doug Cusack.
6. Finally understanding the OCLV carbon frame lineup story.  Red... Black... White... Genius!
7. Being surprised with the intro of the new FuelEX with Travis Brown. Didn't see that coming.
8. Overhearing the Trek Palo Alto Dealer telling stories about Steve Jobs buying a Lime Bike.
9. Watching Trek designers & engineers share their enthusiasm one-on-one with dealers.
10.Bikes shipping Monday you say?  Awesome.

Madone on Exhibit at the Museum

The all-new Madone was looking good last night at the Milwaukee Art Museum

Slideshow: The Unveiling

Well the event went great.  The surprise?  Lance showed up. We'll have some video up soon. Take a look some pix from the evening. Click here to go big